You can be the best programmer in the world, but you still cant make a game…
(i am not calling myself the best progammer ever) PS: i haven't taken college yet.)
Some may say. No that wrong of course the best programmer can make a game.
Let me explain you can make all the functions of a game all the events and collision detection but without graphics and audio you have nothing more then a transparent program.
When i say graphics I'm not saying crysis but I'm saying visuals something that can make the player feel like there in that world.
since i was a little boy i grew up playing NES and i always wanted to make the games that i loved to play every day.
Iv grown up a bit since then and made some poorly executed clones of a couple games. But i decided i want to make something someone else hasten made something new. and i quickly realized that i cant do that. i have no artistic talent, i cant model, and i cant compose music.
I know 1 person cant do all these things but…
Is my dream just a childish one that could never come true? Or should i push on and try to grow some artistic talent and model.
if anyone has any motivational or demotivational advice or stories i would like to hear them. Thankx
Build a team. Manage it yourself, partner with a manager or keep it small enough (2-4) that dedicated management won't be necessary, only clear direction and independent drive. The better the prototype the better prospective talents might join you in your pursuit. Keep it small, make it different.
Best of luck 
hm a team. I still consider myself a child I'm 17 and I'm not too good with programing. that may be modesty i don't no.
I will try to keep myself motivated to continue. I'm going to try to move to 3d with the JME because i think my game idea would work better in 3d then 2d. I have never done any serious 3d stuff before so I'm kinda keeping myself away.
I'm going to try to make a character model in blender but feel that its going to fail horribly.
I always make thing more complicated then they need to be.
If you'd prefer to start out independently, your programming skills are limited, you have no art content and you'd like to see rapid progression, a mod project would be way better to start off with.
While modding you get visual feedback from the very start, as you work top-to-bottom instead of from scratch. Star Craft 2 just got released.
Modding would be a better way to go but i know java and mostly everything is in C++
You could always use existing resources. Also, making a 2D game is a lot easier than 3D, so you can start with that.
Actually my goal is as yours, I want to be as good as possible in everything. I know
that is utopia… 
and it is not just done from one day to another! It is a process.
It took me quite a time to get a feeling for the whole 3d-stuff and I know that there
is still infinite stuff to learn. Isn't that great? It is never getting boring…
About your graphic-skills! After some low tries I actually started about nearly 2 years
ago when I heard about a 48h game coding competition and I decided to use jMonkeyEngine.
Well, it was a catastrophe
Have a look:
http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/2008/12/07/finished-2/
http://thomas.trocha.com/games/ldroads/ld13.html
http://thomas.trocha.com/games/ldroads/LD13_roads_to_insanity.zip
It rather took me some time afterwards trying to finish the game and it was still not good but more or less something you could call a game. Actually it was a composition of tutorials and jmetests. I realized that I
somehow had to learn to model. I started with milkshape what was quite simple and easy to start with
but it was limited and it was clear I had to risk to go to the 'monster' blender. (Actually I thought it was a monster!
Now I know, it is not! It is just the greatest pice of software on my computer)
There are hundrets of millions of tutorials you can read, but you have to be willing and focused and you can only learn from repetition. Doing it over and over again. Frustration is of course a part of it. And sometimes it seems
soo complicated. Try to be concentrated and focus on one thing at a time (which was and is not my strength). Think about what you want to reach and make a list how you think you can reach the goal… Then 'just do it' and
don'T think too big (also not my strength) cause it won't work. Even the simplest game is hard to build. Go step by step…
e.g. read this: http://www.gamedev.net/reference/design/features/makegames/
(I hope that is the article I meant)
I'm not sure if that was so useful now, but if you are willing to learn, and have problems that prevent you
from progress, you have here a real cool community around that helps you if your stuck
Keep on rocking!!
If you want to learn to program a code, but don’t want to learn how to do 3D modelling, starting off with a 2D game is the best idea. As an example of a good 2D game, I just started playing Dwarf Fortress; it’s an ASCII game, which shows 2D views of a 3D world. It’s developed all by one guy, and great fun to play, even though it’s 2D.
Also, as a side note, only being 17 isn’t a limitation, or a reason not to be in charge of a team. I hope Erlend doesn’t mind, but he’s a great example of a good team leader, even at a young-ish age. We both worked on a project a couple of years ago, and while it didn’t result in a finished product, this wasn’t due to poor leadership.
giuseppe105 said:Comprehensive editor tools like that of Warcraft 3, Neverwinter Nights and StarCraft 2 come with their own trigger editors, meaning you can get yourself started with a graphical interface, then catch on to the real workings of the scripting language at your own pace. If you're seeing yourself programming professionally, you're gonna have to widen your horizons beyond Java at some point anyhow ;)
Modding would be a better way to go but i know java and mostly everything is in C++
(keep in mind that I just bought SC2 and I'm psyched about it so that might make me a tad biased about favoring modding right now ^^)
InfernoZeus said:I'm humbled.
(...) I hope Erlend doesn't mind, but he's a great example of a good team leader, even at a young-ish age. We both worked on a project a couple of years ago, and while it didn't result in a finished product, this wasn't due to poor leadership.
After reading all the posts it got my spirits up.
As for 2d programming i was kinda winging it i made my own map maker and engine but its not really finished yet… i kinda stopped working on it because i have to make the map maker first it docent feel like I'm doing much because i don't see the game being built.
I also don't know how map makers get made. its looking good right now but i haven't added in events yet i do have collisions.
I do have the killer game programming for java e-book and source code but its too hard on my eyes to read for long periods of time. I did at one point use Microsoft SAM but slowly gave up because i didn't really get a feel of what the book was saying.
now I'm just blabbing. I'm sorry.
I have progressed a lot with my map maker and engine but its still made improperly. I can look at my code and then see someone else and be like "they have so much less code but it dose the same thing." I know that's because I'm not seeing where i can create methods and just doing liner programming.
Well i think I'm talking to much now if someone wants to look at my code and tell me how I'm doing and places i need to improve on and how to improve on that problem. or has a link to some information on how to go about making, AI, Engine, Animation, map file, the whole slew of things…
yep i bit off more then i could chew.
Well, you don't really need to know all these things to make a game.
Graphics are just a very small part of a game, they're really superficial!
If you're a coder like me, just make some dummy placeholder graphics and work on the game logic instead.
Eventually you could probably find someone interested in graphics to help you with that.
As you're still quite young, perhaps you could make programming your main subject at university?
If you've started learning Java already, you're off to a very good start then!
There are probably several game design/production programmes not too far away for you too, perhaps you could find one you like and that will get you the skills you want?
At least here in Sweden there are several game design programmes/courses and loads of programming ones.
I know, as I'm studying a Bachelor in Computer Science by distance studies, putting together my own degree out of mainly Java courses and Maths (but there are also other things a developer needs, like knowledge in agile techniques and other programming languages).
You also get contacts through university studies and you're likely to meet someone there who share your interests and before you know it you have a team!
Until then you could perhaps post your game ideas here on the forums and see if someone is interested in helping you with graphics and whatever else you need. Usually, graphically talented people are in the same position as you are, only they lack programming skills to make their game and are looking for someone to do that.
Just some thoughts, I hope you continue with your ideas and goals.
Good luck!
The mapmaker sounds like a great start.
Well that really good for the first 8 tutorials last time i tried JME i got the package working in eclipse and made hello world.
I am currently trying to use blender to make a model. from a image.
I will continue to work on my map maker / engine for my 2d game. for a description of the project it looks like RPG maker XP but has custom map files so it can be used in more then just RPG maker xp.
I'm going to try to make the classic Zelda with my engine.
After that or when i give up ill be right back here and i will start learning JME.
The reason i went and attempted to make my own engine was because if i use someone elses engine to make my game half of the code isent mine so i cant really say this is my game because its using someone elses engine.
giuseppe105 said:
The reason i went and attempted to make my own engine was because if i use someone elses engine to make my game half of the code isent mine so i cant really say this is my game because its using someone elses engine.
As much as I would like to disagree with you ( ;) ), it is indeed better to know how it works yourself before you allow something or someone else to take it out of your own hands. But! It's extremely hard to write your own engine without having any skills in writing engines! So in order to learn, you still need to allow yourself to use someone elses engine, for a steeper learning curve. It's also more fun, because you get more visual feedback.
Don't get me wrong though, if you're doing well on your 2D engine then you should of course continue doing that - you'll learn alot. Try to smooooooth yourself into jME3 after that, and you'll be alright. Good luck man, you're on the right track!
tnx XD
Ok let me write my own experience on making games.
I am doing some game almost for a year now (will probably write about it here on the forum in the future when it has more functionality - I am the only one making it…).
Anyway, I also don't have any modeling skills, thats why I decided to make very simple game and complicate it afterwards (its 3D, but all the objects are just simple spheres and cubes and other bodies that can be created dynamically with JME2 - physics can be used easily, now nifty-GUI makes great GUI, you can get lots of free textures online,…).
I probably just want to say that JME is really simple to use and even if you don't have much knowledge using it, you can learn fast and make lots of good stuff…
I could do that. but i always get this voice in the back of my head saying if you don't do it detailed then its not going to get done. So if i made it look all simple i wouldn't feel compelled to continue work i would feel as if i was achieving anything.
finish stuff! reduce your goals/features and finish something! really! I mean it! 
don't cry and don't worry about things not being detailed enough! keep reducing your features, make it simple as simple as it could be and make a finished project! a game can be fun without having fanzy 3d graphics.
there are millions of people like you. great plans. motivated. but there are only a few that have really finished a game project!
a crap but finished game is a lot more worth then an unfinished one. I know this from the endless games I've started but never finished I've only finished one game ever but seeing it on the app store was very rewarding (I mean rewarding on a emotional level - I've not earned any money >_<)
To finish something is the hard but rewarding part (nifty 1.2 is a great example too XD uhm, hides)
don't give up and good luck!
Do it with a friend and be damn proud of what you're doing! Don't be afraid to talk about it like a child, if you find you hate talking about it then its time to change the idea 
But I do agree with void, make sure you really do finish one… I've only made a few "games" before, but had the most fun when I was doing it as part of a class project in college, the goal of finishing (even though it was only two levels) kept us bound through the semester. Those I keep in touch with from those days still reminisce about the trials and tribulations of the experience.
Make sure you enjoy it… whatever it is you work on
There you go giuseppe, you've received enough pep-talk to last an acceptable lifetime. void here is right on the money. Do a small project (we're talking 1-week scope here; it'll turn into 3-4 anyhow), finish it and be happy. If that defeatist attitude sticks all that's been said here is gonna be for naught.